{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/0v89g5j139/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Interview with Shirley Clarke, Part I [1/4-in. magnetic audiotape], April 1969"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/029/original/uo-logo-hires.png?1580744881","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["1 sound tape reel : 3.75 ips; 5 in. 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Under the.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=4.1,8.08"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Rent control. All right. Testing, testing. Okay, here we go. You can start it. Yeah, I got it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=8.49,20.7"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't know, do you think it would be a good idea if, after Bill, you get off the phone that Burt and myself and Jim kind of. I don't know what the question and each other about certain things that we do in and out. Think about all this, and then you fall into it as as you have ideas and opinions and reactions to talking about. What interested me particularly was it meeting Bert, and I was told what he was doing. I thought that I had been invited here on purpose as part of what bird was doing, because it fit so incredibly into areas that he was dealing with. I mean, part of what he's talking about, the breathing. I was trying to experiment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=22.05,67.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e I discovered I had exactly the same sense that made him feel last night took off. Exactly. Very sweet stuff. The first lecture is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=70.76,79.46"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Funny.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=80.0,80.0"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e And that enabled me to to go on or to find something to say in the second.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=80.42,86.78"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. To the nice. But yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=87.24,88.79"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Uncertain about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=89.12,89.66"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e It. Yeah. And then I'll get both of you that way. And without an intro where you just stopped.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=91.74,97.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e But more or less in general, what was what was the thesis of where you would have finally arrived in the first lecture?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=98.99,106.58"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I'm not sure I had reached the. Question, which I didn't state Tuesday night. Nothing. Right. Just said. We've reached, after much labyrinthian wandering, the first understanding of the problem. How to make an honest face of it. How to. How to show an honest face to others and to be ourselves. Not for ourselves, but for others. How? So that's the question that I reached. How to be ourselves one self for another. And that is is a is an inversion in a sense of the question, the problem of your film, how to make an honest film, not of yourself for another, but how to make an honest film of Jason. How to show Jason as he is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=108.32,170.65"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e What do you think of the idea of what I call substitution? In other words, that I'm someone of the opinion that all the films I've made, no matter who they're about, are substitutes for me. In other words, rather than doing an autobiography, which would be one possibility that I take someone else and vicariously live through them find. And generally, my experience has been that when the film is finished that I found certain I've partly found myself and partly revealed myself through using someone else. Maybe it's part shyness, maybe it's part. I don't know exactly why it is. I can't do me vanity. Who knows? But that the very fact that the filmmaker takes on certain controls asks, for instance, certain questions already, by implication, means have put themselves on stage.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=170.98,231.22"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e I think I.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=234.26,235.1"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Think a lot of the notion that the real search for Jason is as identical as or as understandable also as a search.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=235.84,245.43"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e For.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=245.82,245.82"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Oneself, you know, and there's good reason for that. In terms of the I sort of my theory and my understanding that is that the two selves are really the same self, that is the self that you see. And Jason isn't a separate package with its own history and meaning, but that is the deepest, most basic level selves or the psychological or stuff, if you like, is identical and simply similar, but I do it identical. That is, you reach a kind of bedrock in which you see it here, you see it there. The same thing is, is seen in adding somebody.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=246.54,290.13"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e For instance, let's say, who writes a novel about Mr. X and is actually really writing an autobiographical novel, you know, they call them somebody else. They put them in another supposed environment. And it turns out really when they finished that, they've written their story.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=290.58,306.08"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=310.97,310.97"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e It's another kind of search.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=312.8,313.88"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Like I think the she I'm enormously impressed at the moment have been by my colleague at Santa Cruz, Norman O'Brien. And they're the issue is is stated as the world appears, the daily world appears as a world of difference in which everything is different from everything else. There's all the separate things are different. Well, he he stays or he poses the notion that that difference difference is illusion or error and truth is identity. That is, the truth of the thing reveals the identity of the various people so that the movement. Any movement to get into the depths was autobiography, or a deep film or a depth film. We'll move toward this, just an identity of the human reality.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=315.65,373.48"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e I was suggesting, though, the possibility that fiction film and or, let's say a dramatic story also did the same thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=374.35,379.27"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Joyce. And then, you see, there's obviously a lot of stuff. There's a lot of times you can see that there was Shakespeare. You can trace Shakespeare as a person through his plays, made using the work of art as a as an expression of it. So, yeah, let's substitute. Substitute. Yeah, that should work. This is different from what you're you're concerned.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=380.77,402.82"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. Thank you. Can I give you my reaction to the film? Sort of. What? Us. Our my thought was this morning when I just woke up or thought about. Or maybe it was in the middle of the night. It, as I understand it, the issue in in the last night's showing was honest filmmaking. That is what and not simply how to make an honest film. But even before that, what is what does honest filmmaking consist of? What does filmmaking that really is? Is it itself that that is an authentic filmmaking? What what is that consistent? And I just put into a phrase a single sort of poetic or semi poetic phrase that honors the intent of honest filmmaking is to recognize the true face, the true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=404.95,462.66"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e The true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=464.4,464.55"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Face, and that the filmmaking is recognition of it. And that recognition is really a response to to the truth. So I came to the notion that the film last night was a kind of communion that used the religious term communion between two, two phenomena. One was Jason. It was really a communion between Jason wanting to show himself, to present himself or to give himself to. His audience. You in these terms and the camera as accepting or seeing or recognizing what it was that he was showing he was giving and you were taking from him, not taking in the sense of grabbing, but you were accepting what he gave. What his his gift.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=465.27,528.35"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=530.06,530.06"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e He you know, the camera acknowledged his truth. That is the. The meaning or the purpose of the camera as a filmmaker. Quest to acknowledge the truth that Jason was providing. Now, when both did it in a simple, honest, direct way, when he gave himself truly, you know, and you accepted in this simple spirit, then some real filmmaking appeared and was struck. You see the notion of what is the structure of real or honest filmmaking. And the structure seemed to me to be precisely this kind of communion between subject and filmmaker. The communion was one giving and receiving. You can put that in different terms of showing. He was showing and you are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=530.81,583.88"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Looking.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=584.51,584.51"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e For seeing. There's another way to say giving, and it's the film's way of giving and receiving, sort of showing and seeing is is the are the issues. So you have his moment of truth. He said, this is my moment of truth, and your moment of truth as a filmmaker was to recognize it, to to see that it was the truth and to to well, to capture it, to hold to it, and then to do this act of showing it, making it visible to the whole audience. Putting it or putting it up on the screen. And the only thing that's worthy of being shown in this way, put on the screen, you know, what is it that's being that that's worthy of being shown of the audiences, of a real audience's attention is the true thing, you know, not somebody posing and and jumping around. But it's the truth is the thing that that deserves showing. So. Well, I stop there for a moment, but.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=585.47,652.99"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e I guess I should tell you something. Which I've never really told anyone else, but I think I must, in lieu of what you're saying, there's this one sequence in the film that isn't in the finished film, and the reason it's not in the finished film is because it wasn't true when it came back from. Yeah, when I saw it. In other words, as the moment happened, it seemed quite believable and worked. But when I saw it, I didn't believe it. It was a moment before Carl actually starts to attack Jason. When I remind Jason of something really horrendous that he once said to me, you know, one of the probably most evil things ever done to me in my life. And he started to cry. Now, two things are not believable. One, that he's crying because I say it. Secondly, you don't believe that I was in an absolute fury, but I can assure you I was, I really was, I was flipped. I had sort of been waiting all night to finally say this to him and or maybe seven in the morning I had said, all right, I just I'm just going to. But strangely enough, when it came back. You didn't believe it. You didn't believe either one of us. And that means that there is always the possibility that no matter whether you're really you, let's say I feel it's happening and seem to be responding that there is apparently some other world that exists between the two, which happens during that process of taking it on film, rejecting it and having it come back to you where you can look and say, I'm sorry, it's not real.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=653.82,760.04"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e What would it have done to that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=762.92,764.59"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I, I I'm, I, I'm not courageous enough. I would I thought, I figured the reason I removed it finely as I thought it destroyed everything that Bert's been talking about. In other words, because it didn't work, it would then destroy everything else it did because you would suddenly question. Yeah, right. Yeah. What what really in the world was going on if this thing came out the way it did, then what was all the rest?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=765.74,794.23"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, did you think it was not true, or did you think that the the audience wouldn't believe it was true?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=795.13,799.18"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e I knew it was the one. I thought, you know. Yes. The minute I saw it, not one it was happening, was happening at sea. I mean, I know I was in a fury. I remember my emotions well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=799.54,810.94"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e But you didn't believe it. You sounded like you were in a fury.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=811.36,813.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e I sounded like I was provoking him for no other reason than to stick pins in, to see if he would jump.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=814.6,819.88"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e It sounds like some experiences I've had with us before where we had sensitivity sessions, basically. Every time it just, I mean, I would get into it and then I would just completely withdraw my stuff because, I mean, the whole thing was just one big act. You know, I mean, it was it was like people flagellation themselves, you know, and it really was getting to the meat of what the encounter was. Yeah. What strikes me as interesting is that is what the reason for removing it was, if I understand correctly, that you wanted the film to work on the other side for the audience to to believe. Yeah, but Jason was what he presented himself as well. Do you think that maybe. Maybe also, man and slightly because of the personal involvement with you, which was something you really.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=820.69,867.07"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e No. I don't think so. I know what you're saying, and it's a possibility, but I don't think it was that had it worked. I would have left it in. Well, no matter what it it said, what it did say in part, it was incomprehensible. In other words, it was in a strange way out of left field and you couldn't quite understand. Not knowing me and not knowing our past history. Why? I was sitting around for six hours waiting to do this and then suddenly did it. And that was not explained in any possible way, really, in the film. Whereas call and his reactions were revealed from time to time. As the film progressed, I was endlessly playing the role of Tell Me Your Name. Oh, that's very good. How nice. You know, you're doing fine. And suddenly, instead of all that, I went, you rotten. No good. You remember what you once did? I'm never going to forgive you, you know. Whatever. And I was shaking. I was so shaking when I did it. I was trembling all over. And when it came back, it was. It was lousy. Acting is the only way I could describe, you know, like I'm not good enough.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=869.77,935.04"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e You know?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=936.6,936.72"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh. Excuse me. It's because it seems to me that's the filmmaker can do that. That is that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=937.95,943.56"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e That that's the.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=943.89,944.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Camera man. And the film maker is isn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=945.42,950.13"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Can't be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=950.81,951.05"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Provoking can. His role is to see to to receive and and to. You know. And if in this kind of filmmaking, you see once you start arranging and and making him, you know, put things on, then you get out of this role of, of just the, of the confessor, so to speak. So he's confessing and you're receiving and you just can it seems to me you can have it both ways. You can't be arguing. I've been arguing about this this morning, that you can't be the Hollywood director, making things, phoning things up, and hope that somehow an honest film will emerge out of it or not. As that film in the sense that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=951.2,999.59"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e We're talking about your goal is set to reveal something about the person that is, you know, like Larry David falls in love with that money when his artist friend said, you know, it's just, well, you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=999.71,1009.49"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Know, I thought that didn't work, you know, within its terms.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1010.83,1014.55"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I mean, I mean, is this the same sort of thing you're talking about?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1015.23,1017.43"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e The what, bird song? No, I think what bird is talking about is, is attempting to make us clear about the role of the filmmaker and the separation, in other words, that he can't cross a particular line different than, let's say, the person who writes a script and decides to reveal somebody through a preconceived idea and actions that you will put them through. It's a different process, is what is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1017.64,1040.02"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Impossible for the filmmaker himself to enter into.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1040.88,1043.02"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e This is what seems to be the enter that way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1043.5,1046.47"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e But he enters in in that, you know, he's absolutely essential because after all, no one gives unless he's giving to someone who's who's accepting you. So you don't confess as a confessor. There's some, you know, there's somebody listening, accepting that there is. You know what? It's a two sided thing and both sides. But what's essential is that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1046.859,1072.71"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Each.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1074.39,1074.39"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Person who does his own duty, you know, that he that the. This guy doesn't start making films. You know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1075.11,1083.78"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e After what happened that I think it's nice. Oh.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1084.32,1088.81"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. Yeah. By what he acts that he you know that he's he he tells and the other person does the shooting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1090.98,1098.69"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e And you think there's the possibility. Let's say, for instance, there's a guy named Andy Law in, in New York who did a film as follows. There was a girl that he met that he thought was attractive. He said, hey, baby, would you like to be in my movie? And baby said, yeah. So he put her in front of the camera and he started filming her. And then without telling her anything, he gave her absolutely filthy book to read. Totally pornographic. And here was this girl, blushing, you know? Wow. And before the film was over, he makes her on, you know, in the course of the film. Meaning that he then takes a totally active role in putting himself into the situation, almost as if he did the film to do this. It was it was it was absolutely barbaric. Yes. There's no question that there was something barbaric about it. On the other hand, it certainly happened. There's no question that it did take place. And if you want to say it's honest, yes, it was honest. It was also intended to be. Yeah, right. A little bit strange kind of thing to do. But only is this not matter of degree rather than any difference in, in method and procedure and intent? Isn't it merely taking the same thing, only going further.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1100.55,1182.18"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Over his feelings on the film?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1183.11,1184.1"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Andy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1184.91,1184.91"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1185.63,1185.63"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, he just those. Great.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1186.11,1186.83"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. All right. Now, when you were talking about when you got married in Jason, were you camera conscious at the time and knowing that the recorder was going and the camera was running.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1188.86,1199.27"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e I knew the recorder was going. Yes, I knew it was being filmed, obviously, just like Jason did, though I don't think this is a problem. I was I think that awareness is strangely lost.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1199.63,1210.19"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e That you lose that in ten minutes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1212.16,1213.82"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Something like that. Grinding. All things are going along and there are too many hang ups and too many technical disasters and sort of that sort of thing. It does happen and break through. No, it wasn't that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1214.27,1227.74"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Do you think you could have gotten the performance of Jason that this you got out of it? He wasn't this this nightclub type of person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1229.54,1237.73"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e All right. I'll tell you another thing, which I again will tell you off the record. Coincidentally, and strangely enough of this just a month or so before I started actually making the film with Jason, though I had already asked him to do it. Warhol met Jason through Paul Morrissey at a bar. He tried to make a film with Jason Sedgwick, which is in the wastebasket, as far as I understand. They simply couldn't do it. In other words, this is a combination of the right people together, whatever the trust thing is, whatever. I would say it's not only in my case me, but also call. I don't think I could have done it alone. I needed a call in that room who acted as part of me? We became the camera. Not the one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1239.7,1282.12"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e That was catching his questions in the vernacular. So. Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1282.42,1285.06"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e And also, Jason knew he had known him for so long. Like, man, you can't get away with this. Come on now. You know I know better.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1285.45,1291.9"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e It was really nice because it was in the film. You know, this will probably come on the occasions and especially in the context. Jason is black. Right, right, right. The language was typically what you would hear on the street. The load on Houston through the war. Yeah. Does that. That's good.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1292.8,1314.42"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Call. Was there a call? Not been there. That would have been similar. It would not have been able to go as far and as honestly as it did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1314.63,1324.41"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, it's just like any situation that can make any people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1324.74,1328.07"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eUnidentified:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I. Oh, I have to do a radio show.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1329.0,1333.29"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e I really do. Even though the show I do is the person to speak. Yeah. You know, when you actually do a radio show, you say the language even still.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1334.01,1347.27"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Does that because you're controlling it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1348.32,1349.43"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e No. I tried actually one night to do a show. I actually, I found I couldn't because I knew I wouldn't be able to get off.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1351.2,1357.77"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, yes. But then you're just aware that the medium is not going to allow you to do the show. Not that you couldn't do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1358.43,1365.39"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I mean, if I want to approach, probably. Have you. Yeah. Yes. Well, like we're at the moment. Yeah. Yeah. Things like this and some of the others. And the times when I was in different situations, like the language nuances.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1366.28,1387.37"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. You know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1389.59,1391.36"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e So now I'd like to see you use the phrase. Well, I don't remember what the context was. How did you get Jason to do it, or do you think you could have got Jason to do it if something else? Oh, what does it mean? What did Shirley do to get Jason to do it? And it seemed to me what she did was very simple. That is, the directing in this case, was listening. Was it being open to him? She got him to do it. Not by. Not by directing him or manipulating or sticking him, and yet giving him signals, but by the open ears. No looking back. Yes, he had a.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1391.61,1441.12"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Series of signals, which was after every ten minute run out. I'd said to him early in the thing, look, we have this part of the room. The other part of the room has the camera in it, and you can't go behind the camera because, golly, we can't film you. And this is where we lit for. And you have in at the following. You have the floor, you have a chair, you have a couch and you have a mantelpiece. I don't care where you are within this area. This is your area and that is your home. I even went as far as to say, go around my house and find anything you like and put it there. He couldn't have cared less what he put there because it wasn't his. And he he doesn't understand possessions in those terms. All he cared about was what was he wearing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1441.24,1484.86"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh. You were.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1485.91,1486.21"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. What would he wear? All right. So I ended up saying, how's this? And he said, fine. Then I did the following, which does have the implication of control. He started sitting on the couch. Whatever newspaper happened to be sitting there? I said, pick it up. It'll help you. You know, there's an awful problem with anybody. What do you. What do you do with your hands? You know, that's the first thing that gets terribly self-conscious and starts to give it away. So give them something to put in their hands, you know, and let that tension go through. So he took this paper and stuck in his hands. And I would say, well, would you like to sit in the chair? How about the floor? Never say you must. But how about he always said fine and then made it into his place? Once he had done it. Many times he just was wherever he was, and we continued. But there was that much manipulation in terms of and there was also a manipulation. What I asked him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1486.66,1552.5"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. And the question, but I seem to be that the essential really is you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1553.07,1557.39"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e And your Cameron or fuzed now. And that camera is a sort of his a receiving, you know, of a receiving eye, so to speak, which is an eye that just like this one, you know, the two are come together and it's not it's not what you say anymore. It's that camera in that you're working that belongs to you, that's part of you and that he is interacting with. Did you think.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1558.05,1588.95"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e When you saw the film he was talking to me or talking to you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1589.94,1592.49"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e After the show with the camera?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1593.57,1594.38"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. Which which who is that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1594.98,1597.2"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e I thought the camera was. And you were together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1597.89,1600.02"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e So therefore he's talking to me. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1601.16,1602.81"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e No, but I mean, is there something about that we can reveal ourselves more in this way? Because the nature of motion picture of because of this particular mechanical instrument. Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1603.35,1616.42"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I thought that he he.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1617.14,1618.34"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e He.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1618.91,1618.91"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Put it himself. You say this is my moment of truth. This is my chance. Now, the chance really was given to him by having ears, listening. And and I sing. That was his chance. Sort of his moment of being seen as moment of truth. Queen for a day he said yes. And. But his queen for the day was really being king for the day. You know, in the camera's eye, showing himself as he as he was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1619.78,1654.19"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e How much did you feel the situation that he was talking now? All right. So you know who I am. It may not matter, but my impression always was he was talking to a white audience and that had the room full of black people. 50% of this film would have been different. A lot of things, he said. He simply wouldn't have said or said that way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1654.64,1678.6"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e But then the first thing I thought, actually, I was aware that he was talking to people. Yeah, he was aware of the count. I was really conscious of the fact that he knew when he said, on the days that he would get a chance to express to people, as he did later on. Well, I don't know. And I think this is just what he was actually directing his weight.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1679.5,1704.43"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Off his body of humanity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1704.86,1705.99"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1706.68,1706.68"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. That the camera eye is, has a certain universality to it. It's not a particular person time, but when it's the camera that's watching, it's not quite God watching, but all eyes are on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1707.25,1720.27"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, the words if it wasn't for them. If it isn't. What if it is? Was this what happened between two people? You know, just between Shirley and Jason, it wouldn't have been as good as the fact that it was a camp.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1721.08,1734.24"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, I think the.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1735.02,1735.68"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Camera was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1735.8,1736.22"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Obviously.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1737.69,1737.69"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Essential because a filmmaker or a camera worker isn't just like anybody else. He has that universal eye.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1738.02,1745.46"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, but I mean, like, the camera is a machine and it doesn't. I mean, you can say what you want to and it won't. People lash back at you and it won't remember now, but.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1746.36,1754.82"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e It will receive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1754.94,1755.27"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay. But yeah, you know, what do you do? You know that that film never would have been shown.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1756.26,1759.29"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e When we're going to do it tonight and destroy it tomorrow. You wouldn't have done it. Well, it wouldn't have done it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1762.05,1767.24"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Why shouldn't. There was. There you go. Right. There's a sense of of of immortality and. Well, which which tended to be a bait for him to open up the chance.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1767.99,1778.76"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, but.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1779.51,1779.72"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e What he really opened for us, I think if this is a chance for your talent, he was the best thing to be remembered about. And so. So I mean really can reveal himself. Oh, wait.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1779.81,1787.77"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, wait. No, no. Yes. What? Yeah. No, no, you'll forget after a while. For instance, that's what we call about losing camera consciousness. We don't mean. Only mean. You're no longer nervous and rushing around. And you see, we mean not aware and and thinking this thing through, but only being aware. There's someone to talk to who's responding that something's going to happen with it. Making no judgments. Finally, as to whether he did or didn't want this to be ever seen by anybody else. Partly taking the attitude, whatever I do, it's all right. I can do no wrong.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1788.26,1827.36"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, except that I think there is sort of a the camera makes a defines the moment. It is a special moment. It isn't. I mean, like n is telling it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1828.12,1837.26"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Are we talking about the shooting or the viewing now?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1837.74,1839.42"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e No, I'm talking about the actual situation. Jason being there. You know, back to the camera on him. You know, I think he realizes that this is a special moment. I mean, he must have been must have, you know, run and ran on like this before to other people endlessly. So, I mean, what would this in your terms make it be, you know, unique?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1839.96,1860.86"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. Well, I think that's that's sort of this notion of the camera as being the agent of some kind of redemption. It saves, it magnifies. It preserves. It makes the temporary timeless. So to speak, just as a painting does. It captures a moment which ceases to be a moment because it becomes that is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1861.64,1883.99"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Are you talking about the effect the camera has on the performer?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1884.53,1886.09"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I'm talking about. Yes. Well, in this performance, I'm not always aware.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1887.17,1891.82"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Even now, if I can Hall call this the hall, I'm going to change the tape around.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250#t=1892.0,1895.48"}]},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262250/transcript/76689/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/076/689/original/trint_Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_01_transcript.vtt?1740614829","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/076/689/original/trint_Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_01_transcript.vtt?1740614829"}]}]},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 2 of 2 - Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_02.mp3"]},"duration":1903.5951,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/public/images/audio-default.png","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/content/2/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-universityoforegonlibraries.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/262/251/original/Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_02.mp3?1739213543","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":1903.5951,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["AUTO_TRINT_Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_02.mp3 [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e She's a strange","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=4.27,4.79"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Testing. It's happening to us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=5.749,7.89"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, right, yeah, it's happening to us now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=9.7,11.4"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Well now, I want to interject here, you see, I had an interview with Jean Rouge, and he said two interesting things, was one, he confirmed the business of the barrier of one, the little barrier of self-consciousness, or camera consciousness. He says this, as soon as the person gets over the postures and adjusting that he does to his personality, he forgets. It seems that time wears it down, and so he confirmed. You keep going, and you don't call attention back to the thing. But then, now the second point he made, which is rather interesting and ties into what you were saying in terms of the effect of the camera on the subject, is that what he found was that the presence of the cameras, far from being inhibiting, became a catalyst in the sense that it said, because I am a camera here, all things are now possible, I suspend all Your ties with all conventional morality he says there's this sense that because the camera is there and you are before the camera there you have somehow entered into a womb a protective womb of fiction almost which allows you then to Be truthful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=11.71,85.61"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e But why doesn't self-aggr- and ag- ag- whatever that thing is, like vanity and so forth, take over? In other words, why doesn' one attempt, as it were, to put their best foot forward? Which is what you were suggesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=86.13,100.05"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e No, I take care of people. No, everybody, somewhere, somewhere really wants to come out of the state or somewhere in their life. We'll have gone faster if we don't. I've really done all these things. Are we there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=101.42,112.04"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, tell me the difference between you and I sitting up, we've met, we have known each other for a while, we sit up one night until 6 in the morning, chatting, and I tell you all sorts of things about me, and you tell me all sorts things about you, there's no camera rolling, no tape recorder, and we make this exchange, what's the difference now between that and the fact that the camera is there, does it change anything about what we say to each other?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=112.3,137.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 5:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, there is one change, it happened to me today, is that when you are speaking most of the time to people is that you're very conscious of the type of thing that you can tell that person. Depending on what you know about that person, he's going to understand so much about you that he's not going to understand. If you tell him this, he is not going know it, you know, even if you know him very well, if you're soul brothers all the way, you can't tell him how you're not a soul brother too, you you know, the only thing you can tell them is you're a soul brother, you know and then... Look over here!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=137.8,171.94"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, go on a little further, Bert, because I'm not absolutely sure. What places, for instance, did you feel that he was avoiding this? Or did it, once it began, it just be able to just keep rolling?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=171.57,185.85"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I had the sense at the end of the film that when he was talking to Carl, what he was producing, he was producing himself, just in line with what you're saying, not for the general audience, but for Carl. Now, you see in your question, when you talk to your friend, you are for him, for this other, but when you are, yes, you exist, or you are real for him. Now when you're talking for the camera you're real for everyone. It's a more universal situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=187.17,221.85"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e So one is not realer than another, or what is more real?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=222.38,226.06"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e No, except in the sense that it's more general, it's a more general light that shines.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=225.26,236.22"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 6:\u003c/strong\u003e Are you saying that the person is editing himself for a more universal view of himself? Well, I don't know about editing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=236.2,246.04"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e He's real in a universal sense, rather than real in relation to a single other person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=247.54,253.06"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 7:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, sort of knocking off the highs and the lows and just presenting the video.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=254.579,257.54"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, you see, when I talk to you, I talk for you. And my limited understanding of you constrains and directs what I'm saying. But for the camera, there isn't that sense. There isn't a particular person. It's not a particular camera. The camera eye is a general.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=257.61,280.11"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e You have no clue? Because even a person's face can sort of give you a clue as to...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=278.91,284.75"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e But we were in that room watching Jason. I mean we were like this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=285.22,288.32"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e But the clue really is the all-accepting eye of the camera. It's an expression, I'd say, that lens, it's a peculiar kind of expression. It's a expression that accepts everything, that receives everything. It doesn't reject, it doesn't frown. It seems to me it's not simply neutral, being unexpressive, but what it expresses is acceptance, it receives. It's going on is receding. It's the same as the wheels listening. Now, there is one other thought I've had about one other term in this situation. That is the audience, not the audience that was listening to Jason, but your audience. Jim and I were talking about this this morning and it seemed to me It's a three-part situation. There's the actor, Jason, the filmmaker, and the audience that receives the film from you, and that you show now, you show something to them. And in that respect, the film maker is a middle term in a situation, or mediates, I'd say, Jason and this general audience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=289.55,378.15"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Because it brings up the thing that is such an unbelievable hassle, which is depending on who the audience is, it's a million different movies. Well, yes, but no, that's, yes. Whereas the one to me isn't different. You know, like, for instance, no, I'm in an audience and a whole group of people are there laughing away merrily. I laugh. I'm with a group of the people and they're not particularly responding. I don't. In other words, I change as to how I react to the experience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=378.08,405.41"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Picking up on more yet?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=406.7,407.68"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e But now, just as Jason needs an honest filmmaker, the filmmaker needs an honest, receptive, trusting, receiving audience for the fabric to be whole. So that if the filmmaker has a distrusting audience, if the audience thinks that sort of is sophisticated and knows that films are tricky and and thinks it's all... It's all phony, it's faked up in some way, then the thing just doesn't work. For you to mediate between, really, the filmmakers, in some sense, stands for and acts for the audience and produce, so that what he shows, you make the film, it seems you make it out of your own energy in someway, you cut it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=407.92,462.66"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e That was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=463.79,463.95"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e But, you...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=469.41,470.81"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e That's one of my old grading screens. Oh, I see. They have the old grading provision? Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=474.52,478.68"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, but if you are somebody walking off with your equipment... But if the filmmaker accepts his role as mediator, as receiving from him in order to show this truth generally, he does, well, get into an honest way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=479.81,505.03"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't know any filmmakers who will honestly not answer the question that they are making films for audiences to see, you know, that they're not making them put under their beds. Yeah, and satisfaction of merely the experience of making. No, no, they intend, it's fun and all that, but there is a much greater thing at stake, which is that there are other people that are going to be watching the film, and certainly in the editing process, if not in the shooting process, there's a great awareness. In terms of let's say in this case what's left in what isn't as to how will my imaginary audience respond.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=506.38,543.56"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 5:\u003c/strong\u003e That's the other eye, that's the oddity of the thing, because I experience that thing the other way, is that, you know, things that normally I tell people and ideas that when, you know, they're immediately give me some criticisms and say, no, I won't. On the other hand, when I'm editing and by myself there, I know I can just about put anything that I want down. I can say anything, just like Jason can say anything to the camera. When you're making a film and you're imagining your audience, you can just say anything to them that you want to, you We'll be right back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=544.38,574.31"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e We were talking to Santa Cruz a couple of weeks ago about what the Santa Cruz style of filmmaking is. You know, everyone's doing his first film, so there's no sophisticated work. But there was a sense that a certain style developed, and we wondered why and what it consisted of. And it seemed to me that the style was created by a kind of trustful audience and a belief by the filmmaker. That whatever he saw or felt or wanted to show would be received by the audience, which is essentially, you know, in the spirit in which he was showing it. There was a kind of innocence and trust, you might say. So even sort of silly things, all sorts of silly thing were done, but they could only be done if there was a sense that the audience would take what was...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=574.41,626.47"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Jolly, what happens if a filmmaker that gets like me and has had so many experiences? I remember one really ridiculous thing. I'd made a movie about a woman and a dancer and a bullfighter, and accidentally I'd left a filter off in shooting one scene, so it came out blue. So in order to kind of save it and fix it up, I like stuck blue over a whole bunch of scenes and go to a Columbia university seminar, only to have some lady get up and talk about the deep meaning of the blue, and I'm sorry lady, it was a mistake, you know. And it happened rather early in my career that this happened, so rather early on I caught this strange problem of you understand and you understand, you now, each of us unto our own backgrounds and everything else that we bring to a film. This poor lady was going through great changes, you know, and here I'd forgotten to filter.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=627.73,683.87"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, then they can make an argument that your subconscious was at work, that you wanted, you know, that kind of thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=684.46,689.94"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e I can assure you there was no subconscious, just fury, that my husband had left off the filter. I didn't talk to him for a week.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=689.93,695.87"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, the problem Burt brings up, though, is I think a very profound one, that what, in fact, is an honest audience? Were we honest last night? We were certainly permitting the film to happen to us, and we went and were going along with it, but I have a hunch that what makes an honest is a certain preparation. And that preparation is what Shirley gave them before the film.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=697.83,724.87"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, you know, see, here you get into something that's really tricky, because in general, this film supposedly plays in theaters without little Shirley Clarke getting up and telling you this and this and, and this. And is it unfair for me to do it, and therefore already predispose you to looking at a thing rather than having you look at it, make your judgments, respond? In other words, I've sort of foxed you a bit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=725.77,749.23"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, excuse me, I just want to carry that out. I don't like the perjury connotation you give into the word that you foxed it. I think you prepared us well for the picture and put us in the frame of mind as you call on us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=750.09,764.15"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 7:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, but suppose we didn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=764.3,765.16"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, if you didn't, I have a hunch that you would have had part of the audience walking out. You may have. I did something last night.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=765.51,772.67"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e You might have. I did something last night that I've never done before. You've totally did it. No, but I put them in a situation which went, now you can walk out if you want, but... You're gonna miss something. Yeah, right. I suggest you stay, and I was told that most people didn't walk out. Now that has not in general been true, whether I've had a 10 person audience or a 2,000 person audience, usually a pretty substantial handful leave. That was... I must say I did it because I thought I could try it here in a situation, yeah, in a situation I knew certain people, felt comfortable, felt in a way the group was small enough that I could do it. It wasn't demanding really too much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=770.64,814.02"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 2:\u003c/strong\u003e The point you're making, my point, in a sense, is that to achieve an honest audience, the film has to be structured in such a way that that audience is conditioned to the attitude it must have toward the film.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=816.68,829.56"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Sorry. Yeah, but boy, how can they do this with all the wood?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=831.12,834.04"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 6:\u003c/strong\u003e It's a cool world the way you open it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=834.87,836.69"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. All right. Yeah. Yeah, very often you do it in the film itself. Yeah","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=836.88,841.44"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e And everybody else, yeah. Was it surprising? Was it surprisingly black? You went through a list of characters in the film. Was it surprised when you came on that Jason was black? Yeah. Did it surprise you? Oh, really? Thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=841.54,854.7"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, I never thought of that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=856.57,858.33"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e It goes in this tape.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=858.46,859.1"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Was it a surprise to you? Yeah, it was. It wasn't a surprise. Oh, that's so funny. I never thought about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=860.32,865.66"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e You didn't think it was white, I mean, that's what I'm interested by now, because the impression, I really didn't, it was really beautiful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=864.77,871.35"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e That's right, yeah, right,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=875.71,877.09"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e I almost said man, I had to clean up this guy, you know. Oh my god! Well, we cannot have...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=877.97,883.17"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e We cannot ask you the question, but we can ask everybody else. After a while, was he black or was he a person? No, he was a person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=882.39,889.07"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 4:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah right. It really took me a while to realize.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=889.31,891.63"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Because to me, yes, he was black, and that accounted for a number of things that we were hearing and seeing, but that sure wasn't the... And one of the reasons I chose him was he was Black. And I was very anxious to prove out something, which was a human being is a human, being is human being. And not only that, he's a hustler, he is a fag, he, you know, name it. He sure ain't who we are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=892.43,916.11"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e We see he really underlined, he's had some marvelous things. I wrote my notes in the dark and I discovered I can't read them in the morning, but I know one of the things toward the end of the film he ended by saying was he listed some things about some other people, and he said, and they call me queer. Because what he was doing was being straight. He said, if you want to make it, you can't fake it. He was being straightforward. But he had the label, queer, you know? Right, right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=917.85,959.96"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e It's weird to go to another meeting not clear in the sense of homosexuality, but clear in the sense strange. That's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=961.06,967.34"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e That's right. Yes, crooked is what he meant there, and they call me...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=966.9,970.48"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e And you call me queer. Well, you're much freakier than I am. I may be homosexual, but you're really queer. So you had a...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=971.52,977.78"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e So you had a, you know, the film could be the straight queer is the...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=977.3,981.94"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e I was glad for that kind of surprise because it gave me a chance to honestly look at a point of view that I've always wanted, you know, there's several points of view I've wanted to look at, but all the time before I preconceived, you have these hangouts. You've been set up for it. Yeah, I've been setup for it, and this just sort of slipped by my hands in the dark.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=982.98,1004.4"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 9:\u003c/strong\u003e One thing that we did about it in Winningville... You were going to show him because it took him so long to get into it because he was talking about balling all the time yeah right right and then all of a sudden he started creeping into this this other side and it was real nice it wasn't like warhol you know putting up well it was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1006.57,1034.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e It was accepting Jason, quote, not as a freak, but as a human being, and not saying, I will show you how really freaky this guy is, I'll show you have human he is, of which one of the things he happens to be is a homosexual, by the way I even suspect that. He at one point in the film said something I think very important which may slip by, which is that he travels in this sort of theatrical world. That it's safe if you're queer, because white guys don't get uptight if you not looking at their chicks, you know, and that isn't putting them on. And I've been told by black friends of mine that this accounts for a certain amount of professional homosexuality in the black intellectual world. There's a good way to get around, to get maneuverable, because nobody will, you know... And here's Jason exposed at a terribly early age to everything, you know, name it, he's seen it, from 11 on. And almost choices made. Granted, he contains within him the rather classic set up for being a homosexual. The tough father, the overindulgent mother, you know, all the Freudian things we know. But way beyond it is this enormous consciousness on its part about how to operate. You want to operate and what is expedient to you to do. Yeah, it is then expedient to be. And I happen to have a girlfriend of mine who I know for a fact, Jason, has endlessly been trying to make. Now he's been trying to make it because he wants something from her, but he sure has been trying to make it. You know, so, you know, like, he don't care. You know. Name it, ah, as he says, I'm experimental, queen, I'll do anything, once.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1033.76,1146.42"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 9:\u003c/strong\u003e You know who's really really who and it seems like he he works that do everything in this life He always turns the table but always taking a completed family photo.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1158.97,1177.89"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e How naive do you think Jason really is? Because to me, there's a, no, I think there are some really extraordinary naivete's in him, such as the fact that he really doesn't know, in the truest sense, that there's something wrong about going into somebody's house and taking their furniture and selling. I mean, that really, this is not a moral right and wrong judgment. It's like, there it is, why not? One thing that struck me was something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1178.48,1203.64"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e In the dormitories, and just a half phrase that he didn't really finish, he said something like, you know, I was, you now, I, I I was ready, not, it was something that, in fact, I was either ready for everything, or that I was you know I was open to everything, and I don't know why, I felt like he never really got away from it, you know, this kind of childish acceptance of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1209.01,1229.43"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, well that's what I refer to as his naivete, because there's a whole area of Jason that forgets it. You cannot hold with him a discussion on Vietnam. There is no question that to do so is to totally waste your time, because he will make either some joke or some crack and take off. He is not interested. He is interested in number one, Mr. Jason Holliday, who used to call, believe it or not, Aaron Payne, oh my God, and doesn't know that he changed his name from Payne to Holliday. You know, that little thing he is not aware of. I once pointed out to him, he still doesn't know what I'm talking about. You know, that you take pain and turn it into holiday. To him, there's a whole other reason. He liked Billie Holiday, and that's why he took the name Holiday, he likes, you know. So, the subconscious operations are very busy there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1229.34,1278.36"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e I want to ask you a question. I was always expecting Jason to lash out at the camera and the whole set up because if it were as you said, you just gave him this one little space like a laboratory experiment and he started pacing up and down and I was wondering why he didn't just explode the whole thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1278.85,1298.55"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e It really was quite enough. It looked on camera because the lens size we were using as being a smaller area than it really was. It was quite enough.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1298.43,1307.61"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e No, but still I mean he was trapped, you know, I mean all of a sudden, you know, like it was fun and games, he was going to do it and he started out doing his routines. He accepted a certain discipline, yeah, he accepted a certain discipline. Why wouldn't he lash out? I mean, why wouldn't somebody, for instance, he has the question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1308.56,1324.88"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e But isn't the thing that he wasn't enclosed. He was really, you know, you might say, if you are on a stage, in a sense, you're enclosed by the stage. But in another sense, it's a pretty large place. The whole auditorium, the whole theater is yours.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1325.56,1343.88"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e That whole room was also still there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1343.69,1345.43"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e It's a wide space. Now, I want to, Mary, just sort of come back to what I think is the whole of the movement that we're concerned with. And we talked about sort of moving from Jason to the camera, to the audience, but Jason himself was, you asked the question beginning, who's the filmmaker? Is Jason the one? And it does seem to me that he had he was terribly important in making the film. That is, in the sense that a filmmaker might only write a script. He was writing the script, and that part of the thing was his.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1346.49,1385.91"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e I got everybody so annoyed at Tennessee when I said this. They kept thinking I was copping out, that I wasn't taking responsibility for my role, that I was putting it on Jason.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1387.81,1397.73"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e It's his personality. How could you write it? But now, if one can describe, in just a bit more theoretical terms, the whole movement is that from a completely private realm, a private reality, or an interior realm, Jason's interiority, to the public viewing in the auditorium. You know, when Jason... Is on on displays or is displayed not for the camera but for everyone. Now that's coming coming out of out of that darkness if you like of the privacy of his privacy what he feels of what he is only to himself and into this enormous light and illuminated area of the screen it seems to me that this really represents the Well, the range of the film process, maybe there's some more that I don't see.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1400.29,1463.41"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Does it lead though to the next step where we all start to pull back which is known as exploitation or invasion of privacy or whatever you may...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1462.6,1473.16"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, it does if you're acting the part of a psychologist, if you have a psychological eye trying to see into him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1473.61,1483.71"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 5:\u003c/strong\u003e It's determined by the mediator. If you had given us that impression, the filmmaker, if we didn't trust the filmmaker then we wouldn't even have been able to get him to talk to the film.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1484.91,1496.25"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e But you know, I wasn't doing much of saying, what is your name? Well, just by not saying anything at all. Well, that's the great thing. Not to say anything. I see, yeah. If I had said, oh, and you just revealed. And if you had pushed it a little bit, like you were sorry about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1496.15,1514.77"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 5:\u003c/strong\u003e And if you had pushed him a little bit, like you, that was sort of, that's the thing I sort of didn't like about Carl, because I thought Carl was pushing him, trying to get something out of him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1510.17,1522.27"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 1:\u003c/strong\u003e I agree, absolutely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1522.44,1523.56"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e There is, yeah, there's a problem there, which is something that I don't know really what to do about, because I like it because of what happened, but I also like it, because I know something that not everybody knows, and I don' know any way of explaining it to you. In order to do so, it would take a half hour within the film, and God knows, I don't know how, which is exactly why it was that Carl did this. And there's a very, very logical, concise reason that has nothing to do with anything excepting that at 5 in the morning, after 10 hours with Jason and, remember now, not only have we all heard this many, many times before, but Carl has heard it endlessly, and here we are, supposedly, making a movie that's supposed to be doing certain things and Carl is saying to himself, ah, come on now. You know, early in the thing he says something like look we've heard it all before look I mean Kitty Cunker said the same thing you know get off it you know he knew he knew it Jason that he wanted to see come out right exactly right and and also there was this inner thing that What can you do about it? He was really angry. He'd been holding many angers for a long time in an odd way because he is an actor and because he's who he is. Wanting, a little bit like when I blew my top to get...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1523.81,1610.07"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 7:\u003c/strong\u003e Back, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1610.23,1612.23"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, I mean, at one point I had said to Carl after we saw the rushes, I said, do you want this to stay in the film? Do you realize what the implications are of what you've done? What people will think of you? You know, boy, you're a pretty cruel, rotten character to do this since people don't really understand. No, no, no. Because Carl as an actor's first reaction to all this is, god damn it, he's a good actor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1613.91,1640.59"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 7:\u003c/strong\u003e Mm-hmm","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1641.11,1641.11"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e you know, like, you know he was pretty jealous of it and that was coming out. There were so many things hidden underneath and I never figured out how the hell to let you know all this and I decided to let your get uptight about it and not particularly dig it because a few things that did happen such as that marvelous revelation where you know, Carl talks about quit acting and he turns it off, is so important to understanding what Jason really can and does do and how he does play with you. In other words, the tears are less real than that laughter. His laughing is his hysteria. Those tears are crocodile tears. He didn't give a darn whether Carl was upset because he'd written nasty letters once about other people and really got Carl in trouble. He doesn't have nothing wrong about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1642.0,1698.98"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e He doesn't have nothing wrong about that. I have a question that has about three parts to it. One of them is the idea of the filmmaker making a film and having an analogy toward Jason. In other words, error and pain and Jason. Like the Jason, this part of Jason that he wanted to see is kind of like the filmmaker putting onto the screen what, you know, as Jason saw himself, you know, that as Aaron Payne saw himself as Jason Palme, the filmmaker makes a film about how he sees himself as filmmaker and also This thing about Carl in his relationship to Jason, in that Carl's own frustration at being an actor, always having this layer upon layer of acting in front of him, and seeing also that Jason could...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1697.69,1759.84"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e And here's this guy who's not an actor who suddenly goes, pshhung. Well, but yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1760.23,1763.59"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e I mean Jason wasn't ever getting through the act and he wasn't getting to his real self. Was Carl also frustrated that maybe he had locked himself in his own act? Oh, I'm sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1763.03,1772.01"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, I'm sure that they would, you know, we want to analyze call.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1771.43,1773.85"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 8:\u003c/strong\u003e Get out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1775.31,1775.59"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e No, no, but I mean that would be a rather legitimate thing to do and perhaps when this happened I should have been smart enough to then Let call reveal himself more so that you would have understood But I didn't and so my choice later came as to whether it would stay or not stay as I said","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1775.97,1794.45"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 5:\u003c/strong\u003e See, that's what, if you were interested in calm, all right, then that sort of gets us into calm, but by, it seems, see, even your criticism of Jason, and what, somehow, by what you say about Jason,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1795.21,1808.45"},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSpeaker 3:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't know how to tell you this, but I kept thinking all the time that the story behind the camera was going on and it was being revealed. That the very fact that there was a certain kind of pseudo-politeness at the beginning that gradually shifted and all that sort of thing was giving you hints that something else was going in that room and that there almost in a way another film being made that you were overhearing rather than seeing. And that that was a way kind of enough. At one time, I remember thinking, well, maybe what I should do is get Colin and the cameraman and myself back into the room, put a camera, turn it the other way, and film us. Well, had I done it at the same time, that would have been, you know, quite something else. But I didn't. That would have again been something. And then I kept being so intrigued in what I thought was how much is revealed by so little, so few cues, what you get. But I know what you're talking about. And I'm just not gonna take it away, just like there are certain scenes that are rather long for no purpose, except boy, it's just one of the great lines of all time and I want it in. You know, sort of thing, and that the development of...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251#t=1808.29,1898.31"}]},{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://uoregon.aviaryplatform.com/collections/236/collection_resources/141752/file/262251/transcript/79518/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/079/518/original/trint_Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_02_transcript.vtt?1747070272","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/079/518/original/trint_Coll458_jb0006_Clarke_02_transcript.vtt?1747070272"}]}]}]}